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With that 70A fuse removed, EVERYTHING works normally except the (over)powered steering & the (nearly useless) ESC, including its traction control system.

I leave my 70A fuse in the open slot below where it's supposed to go. I only replace it when someone else is driving, so they have power steering to park.
 

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I say "nearly useless ESC" because even with it on, when I tested it floored from 0-60 once in the rain on a vacant road it still allowed my stickier aftermarket tires to spin repeatedly (at least 3 times), each time with severe, sudden, lane-changing torque-steer, & subsequent sudden cancellation of torque-steer, requiring large quick steering inputs to stay in one lane.

I also routinely do stable, easily-controlled slides with it off, at 63mph on a local offramp marked "30", with moderate understeer even though I no longer have narrower front rims. I have no need at all for any sort of electronic help.
 

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Discussion Starter #23
With that 70A fuse removed, EVERYTHING works normally except the (over)powered steering & the (nearly useless) ESC, including its traction control system.

I leave my 70A fuse in the open slot below where it's supposed to go. I only replace it when someone else is driving, so they have power steering to park.
I'll have to try it. I usually hit the ESC off button on the dash before I hit the road and I am not sure if that fully disables it. I'm used to no power steering in my old cars. Builds character.
 

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I think you're catching the stability control thus the sluggish feeling off the line.
Exactly. All EVs apply traction control because of the instant torque — otherwise everybody will be spinning wheels all the time. The lead Bosch engineer for the 500e used to post in the (now defunct) Google+ forum, and he said the motor has enough torque to break the tire bead from a standing start.
 

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Fortunately there's no risk of the latter, since even high-traction tires lose road grip before losing bead grip on the rim.

Slamming MY 2013 accelerator from a standing start, going straight on pavement that's smooth warm flat level clean..:

  • Dry road, stock, ESC on: One wheel spun a tiny bit (maybe half a turn), then ESC would take over until about 25mph where there was one big final chirp.
  • Dry road, stock tires, ESC off via fuse removal: One wheel spun continuously.
  • Dry road, upgraded tires, ESC on or off: No wheel spin*.
  • WET road, ESC on: 1/2-1 turn of wheel spin, repeated multiple times at about 10-15 mph intervals.
  • Wet road, ESC off: Continuous spin.
*If only ONE factor is missing, a wheel will start to spin. For example a paint line, dirt, slight corner, slight uphill, etc.
 

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Discussion Starter #26 (Edited)
More testing this morning. I have video, but need to edit first.

Conclusion:
From 96% SOC down to 76% SOC no major change in 0-60 or 1/4 miles times. AC on or Off no major difference. 70A fuse pulled no difference. I'll fill in the details later, but here are all of my times over the past few days. This car is very consistent and would make a good bracket racer, but just not very fast.
 

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2017 Fiat 500e (Billet Argento), 2015 VW Golf Sportwagen TSI 5MT (Tungsten Silver), 2002 Honda VFR
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Fortunately there's no risk of the latter, since even high-traction tires lose road grip before losing bead grip on the rim.
Not true, i used to work for a drag racing prep shop from Japan called Escort Racing and we'd paint a white paint on the rim and sidewall of the tires and without using bead locks bolts you can see where the rim spun inside the tire as the white line is no longer aligned where it was. It can def happen, probably not our cars but if you got enough traction and power you can.
 

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Not true, i used to work for a drag racing prep shop from Japan called Escort Racing and we'd paint a white paint on the rim and sidewall of the tires and without using bead locks bolts you can see where the rim spun inside the tire as the white line is no longer aligned where it was. It can def happen, probably not our cars but if you got enough traction and power you can.
o_O
I'm going to steal some white out from work and see if I can get it to do this.

What did you do to your 60' times Watt_up?

Are we going to start airing our tires down next?
 

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o_O
I'm going to steal some white out from work and see if I can get it to do this.

What did you do to your 60' times Watt_up?

Are we going to start airing our tires down next?
High end wheel makers like Rays Engineering actually puts purposeful knurling sipes on the rim where the bead rests to help with that tire moving on the rims during hard braking or track use.
 

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Discussion Starter #31
o_O
I'm going to steal some white out from work and see if I can get it to do this.

What did you do to your 60' times Watt_up?

Are we going to start airing our tires down next?
Flat road/surface, Shift to N, go pedal to the floor, foot off brake and shift to D.
That yielded the best of the poor results, but uneventful in my case. No tire spin or even a chirp.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
Side note. I had close to 500ftlb of nearly instant torque on my supercharged Tundra and never broke/spun a tire on the rim. So I don't think 150ftlb on a street tire would be a problem.

They did however wrinkle pretty good.
109029
 

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Side note. I had close to 500ftlb of nearly instant torque on my supercharged Tundra and never broke/spun a tire on the rim. So I don't think 150ftlb on a street tire would be a problem.

They did however wrinkle pretty good.
View attachment 109029
We have a pos tundra in the shop on its 5th motor with a SC by Magnuson and a bully dog tuner what a POS!! The owner has be the dumbest to keep throwing money into that truck which keeps blowing up.
 

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Discussion Starter #34 (Edited)
We have a pos tundra in the shop on its 5th motor with a SC by Magnuson and a bully dog tuner what a POS!! The owner has be the dumbest to keep throwing money into that truck which keeps blowing up.
Dang! Those motors use to be pretty expensive. Mine was a 2008. Was used and abused every weekend. Had countless bottles of nitrous run through it before the supercharger. She took it like a champ. I too had the Bully Dog. Ran [email protected] and surprised a lot of people on the street.
 

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Dang! Those motors use to be pretty expensive. Mine was a 2008. Was used and abused every weekend. Had countless bottles of nitrous run through it before the supercharger. She took it like a champ. I too had the Bully Dog. Ran [email protected] and surprised a lot of people on the street.
1st motor bent a rod, 2nd, 3rd and 4th one blew ringlands and was burning like a 1qt of oil a mile lol, 5th one has a hole in #6 and partially melted #4 piston. This time looked like he had a overdriven pulley for more boost. as if your gonna have a better result from the last 4 motors this time around with more boost? 🙄 Needless to say this time around hes putting truck back to stock, and selling it. Its either this stops or his marriage lol.
 

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Side note. I had close to 500ftlb of nearly instant torque on my supercharged Tundra and never broke/spun a tire on the rim. So I don't think 150ftlb on a street tire would be a problem.

They did however wrinkle pretty good.
View attachment 109029
It has more to do with shock loading, in the shop cars they ran lenco airshift gearboxes and they launch with tremendous torque/shock off the line it wheelies straight out the gate.
109030
109031
 

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I can understand in 1000+ whp drag cars, but not in our 100ish hp/tq 500e's.
Could be we have a 9.60:1 final drive has anyone ever dynoed a 500e to see what sorta of power/tq it puts out? I feel it might be more then they state. I’ve driven 117hp cars and I’ve driver cars with 501hp / 464tq (My former Z) and everything in between but this slots around what a 190hp/250lb car performance is like.
 

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As a point of reference, the Chevy Spark EV has 400 ft-lb. However, its traction control doesn't allow you to utilize the torque off the line. In fact, the 500e with less torque feels more lively than the Spark because of the software. The electric drive on these cars are very capable but the real limiting factor is their software tuning for commuter driving.

 

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As a point of reference, the Chevy Spark EV has 400 ft-lb. However, its traction control doesn't allow you to utilize the torque off the line. In fact, the 500e with less torque feels more lively than the Spark because of the software. The electric drive on these cars are very capable but the real limiting factor is their software tuning for commuter driving.

It’s not just software, the Spark has a much taller “reduction” final drive which negatively affects accelerating. Early Sparks had 3.17:1 newer ones 3.87:1 that’s a huge disparity from out 9.6:1
 
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