Who else on here autox's their Abarth in the SCCA solo program?
lets share some info!
lets share some info!
Autocrossing
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awesome! you got any pics?
what tire do you plan on going with after the pirelli's wear out? (I burned mine up this summer, they last about 10 events). It looks like the Ventus RSIII v2 and the BFG Rivals are going to be the top auto-X tire next season from the sounds of it. Most guys at nationals were running the RSIII and apparently BFG was a little embarrassed about that. they promised to come out with a new version of the rival next season to try to reclaim the top spot.
Do you run any mods? what class are you in?
here are some of my pics
nice pics. anyone else got some pics
AutoX, here's 10 things I have learned this year.
1) rotate tires after every event, or else you will end up with a set of bald tires up front
2) When entering a corner, you want the car to rotate. Replacing the rear torsion bar with a thicker, stiffer model will cause the rear of the car to swing around better and reduce understeer.
3) improving the driver is way harder than improving the car.
4) An Abarth (in the right hands) is deceptively fast, especially through a slalom. The Abarth being thinner than most vehicles, can take a slalom faster than most wider cars can.
5) In stock form the Abarth will pick the rear inside wheel up off the ground in a hard corner
6) Pirelli P zero nero's aren't really a good autox tire. They tend to get greasy when hot, not sticky like they should. A better tire for auto x would be Hankook Ventus RSIII V2's or BF Goodrich Rivals.
7) I have had this car sideways, in a wide sweeper, at 55 mph with no issues. So don't worry about rollover.
8) A run at 85% is always faster than a run at 110%
9) Autocross people are really nice
10) Motorsports are expensive
1) rotate tires after every event, or else you will end up with a set of bald tires up front
2) When entering a corner, you want the car to rotate. Replacing the rear torsion bar with a thicker, stiffer model will cause the rear of the car to swing around better and reduce understeer.
3) improving the driver is way harder than improving the car.
4) An Abarth (in the right hands) is deceptively fast, especially through a slalom. The Abarth being thinner than most vehicles, can take a slalom faster than most wider cars can.
5) In stock form the Abarth will pick the rear inside wheel up off the ground in a hard corner
6) Pirelli P zero nero's aren't really a good autox tire. They tend to get greasy when hot, not sticky like they should. A better tire for auto x would be Hankook Ventus RSIII V2's or BF Goodrich Rivals.
7) I have had this car sideways, in a wide sweeper, at 55 mph with no issues. So don't worry about rollover.
8) A run at 85% is always faster than a run at 110%
9) Autocross people are really nice
10) Motorsports are expensive
Not sure which tire to get. These are all my possibilities; nexen, yoho s drives or AD08's, bfg gforce, conti dws, ++dunlops zii's, bfg comp2(hard sidewalls), Falken rt615k/azenis, ++Hankook r3, toyo proxes r1r or toyo r888, federal 595 rsr. It will be whatever the local tire place has or can order from my list in the 80.00 to 120.00 range. I will be putting them on 17" NeuF wheels so I can swap them out on Auto cross and track days. Having the tires in the front of the car at 48 or max for the tire really helped me from rolling over onto the sidewall. If you have a track near you that does HP driver's ed class, do it! Unfortunately, you go back again and again. And yes, it does get expensive. I have a piggyback ECU from Madness, a go pedal, some springs to lower and tighten the suspension and a neuf 28mm bar in the back. The Abarth handles really well with just these add-ons.
I just started auto crossing last fall. Just two events so far. I don't have a lot to add right now other than it is a ton of fun!!! I'll be taking the novice class next spring and hope got improve my style. In the meantime, I'll be on this forum looking for tips. Thanks.
I started autocrossing in April 2104 and since then I have done three schools and about 10 events.
I love the attention the Abarth gets at the pad. Everyone seems interested in it, from what have I modded to make it sound the way it does (its stock) to how well it breaks on stock pads to the times such a "cute" car can post.
My first few events were done on the stock Pirelli's and were not rotated between events. This summer I will be getting new street tires. They are far far from an optimal tire choice. For tires I run 205/50/16 Direzza ZII's. Those seem to be what most out here run, it appears to have the widest temperature band out of all the street/autocross tires. There may be better tires at high temps (for Arizona) that give better grip however here we never really reach those temps and require a tire that will still be grippy at a balmy +3C.
This coming year I'm hoping to add a rear sway bar to help the back end rotate a little better, it will be my first true mod to the car (other than tires and 3pt harness).
Everyone involved with autocross out here is more than willing to help and teach, it is a truly great community that is focused on driver development.
As for tips:
-Have rear tire pressure higher than front to help the back rotate, for exact pressures that will depend on conditions.
-Listen to the experienced guys and have them ride with you.
-Slower is generally faster, on really tight turns if you think you're going to slow its probably the right speed.
-A slower clean run is usually faster than a fast run with cone hits.
-Years of Forza and Gran Turismo do not help! In fact I had to relearn what lines to look for/use as autocross is totally different.
-SoloStorm is an amazing app if you can afford it. Being able to compare lines and throttle input/speed though corners between your own runs is amazing, even better if you can get an experienced driver to co-drive your vehicle and compare with them. Plus it does cool video overlays.
-Oh, and pay attention to surface changes, both dips and texture changes mid course.
And now for a couple pics and a video of the Abarth doing what it does best.
I love the attention the Abarth gets at the pad. Everyone seems interested in it, from what have I modded to make it sound the way it does (its stock) to how well it breaks on stock pads to the times such a "cute" car can post.
My first few events were done on the stock Pirelli's and were not rotated between events. This summer I will be getting new street tires. They are far far from an optimal tire choice. For tires I run 205/50/16 Direzza ZII's. Those seem to be what most out here run, it appears to have the widest temperature band out of all the street/autocross tires. There may be better tires at high temps (for Arizona) that give better grip however here we never really reach those temps and require a tire that will still be grippy at a balmy +3C.
This coming year I'm hoping to add a rear sway bar to help the back end rotate a little better, it will be my first true mod to the car (other than tires and 3pt harness).
Everyone involved with autocross out here is more than willing to help and teach, it is a truly great community that is focused on driver development.
As for tips:
-Have rear tire pressure higher than front to help the back rotate, for exact pressures that will depend on conditions.
-Listen to the experienced guys and have them ride with you.
-Slower is generally faster, on really tight turns if you think you're going to slow its probably the right speed.
-A slower clean run is usually faster than a fast run with cone hits.
-Years of Forza and Gran Turismo do not help! In fact I had to relearn what lines to look for/use as autocross is totally different.
-SoloStorm is an amazing app if you can afford it. Being able to compare lines and throttle input/speed though corners between your own runs is amazing, even better if you can get an experienced driver to co-drive your vehicle and compare with them. Plus it does cool video overlays.
-Oh, and pay attention to surface changes, both dips and texture changes mid course.
And now for a couple pics and a video of the Abarth doing what it does best.
Welcome to the forum.
Nice vid
1.14 lateral G's!!!!! most impressive!
Direzzas seem like a good fit, How did your times compare after switching from the pirelli's to the ZII's?
Most guys in my area run the Hankooks.
What class did you compete in, and how did you place this year?
If you have access to a machine shop you can build your own upgraded rear sway bar for around $50 or less. Here is the one I designed and it works wonders. In the post below I have made recommendations as to which material to build the bar out of. There is also a drawing you can download and print off.
http://www.fiat500owners.com/forum/26-fiat-500-diy-section/66489-almost-free-rear-torsion-bar-500-abarth.html
Direzzas seem like a good fit, How did your times compare after switching from the pirelli's to the ZII's?
Most guys in my area run the Hankooks.
What class did you compete in, and how did you place this year?
If you have access to a machine shop you can build your own upgraded rear sway bar for around $50 or less. Here is the one I designed and it works wonders. In the post below I have made recommendations as to which material to build the bar out of. There is also a drawing you can download and print off.
http://www.fiat500owners.com/forum/26-fiat-500-diy-section/66489-almost-free-rear-torsion-bar-500-abarth.html
1.14 lateral G's!!!!! most impressive!
Direzzas seem like a good fit, How did your times compare after switching from the pirelli's to the ZII's?
Most guys in my area run the Hankooks.
What class did you compete in, and how did you place this year?
If you have access to a machine shop you can build your own upgraded rear sway bar for around $50 or less. Here is the one I designed and it works wonders. In the post below I have made recommendations as to which material to build the bar out of. There is also a drawing you can download and print off.
http://www.fiat500owners.com/forum/26-fiat-500-diy-section/66489-almost-free-rear-torsion-bar-500-abarth.html
Direzzas seem like a good fit, How did your times compare after switching from the pirelli's to the ZII's?
Most guys in my area run the Hankooks.
What class did you compete in, and how did you place this year?
If you have access to a machine shop you can build your own upgraded rear sway bar for around $50 or less. Here is the one I designed and it works wonders. In the post below I have made recommendations as to which material to build the bar out of. There is also a drawing you can download and print off.
http://www.fiat500owners.com/forum/26-fiat-500-diy-section/66489-almost-free-rear-torsion-bar-500-abarth.html
That is using my Nexus 5's sensor so I wouldn't put too much stock into it
But it is a significant bump over stock.Not running the same course back to back it's hard to tell but I would say they are good for at least a full second and a half (raw time) over stock tires and are way more sensitive to tire pressure adjustments too. I've mentioned it other posts but the reason I went for the Direzza is that it has the widest temperature band of any of the autocross/street tires. Since I don't have the money or storage for 3 or 4 sets of tires I needed a tire that would run from +35C at the height of summer down to a balmy +1C or +2C for the winter 'Slush Series' which the Direzza does wonderfully. There are better tires for proper summer heat but it only gets hot enough here 3 or 4 days a year to take advantage of that over the Direzza so it's not worth it.
I run in G Street, it gives the best PAX modifier I can get and keeps me from blowing my bank on mods
I wasn't able to do a full year with VCMC due to work constraints and a poorly timed vacation, however when I did run with them I was consistently 2nd or 3rd place for the novice group (my first year doing it). When I run with the BC Corvette Club I've peaked at 3rd on PAX and usually within top 10. I would credit the tires for most of that.I may have access to a friend of a friend who has a machine shop so I'll look into the upgraded torsion bar. Thank-you
Ah yes, G street class..... I have been looking into the allowable mods for G street. I talked to Koni about Double-adjustable shocks. They get expensive....I run in G Street, it gives the best PAX modifier I can get and keeps me from blowing my bank on mods
Jeffrey,
The sport yellow dampers can be converted to DA in our service center. The price to convert is $450/ea. on the front struts and $400/ea. for the rear shocks. Which is on top of the price of the dampers. Those modifications also require standard shop lead time which is currently at about 7-8 weeks.
Mason O’Hara
KONI North America
1961A International Way
Hebron, Ky. 41048
The cheapest I could find the Koni yellows is here: http://sohiperformance.com/koni/koni_shock_sport_series/80401398sport/i-1733419.aspx
They run 223 for fronts and 153 for rears. Total cost for making double adjustables are $673 per front and $553 per rear. $2452 total not including tax or shipping.
Are you running crash bolts?
As far as I know, allowed mods for G Street are:
Any exhaust behind the last Catalytic converter (Aka you can add an Catback or Axleback exhaust). It must be full length, reach the rear bumper
Any drop-in filter (you cannot change the intake or modify the airbox or intake tube)
Any shocks/struts that mount up as stock replacements (though you can currently have external reservoirs).
Change, replace or remove ONE sway bar. One of the two bars must remain *OEM and attached though it is your choice of which one to modify (though a rear bar is the only one that makes sense for this car)
OEM Crash/Camber Bolts. No OEM option currently but the -1.5 stock should be good enough!
Any brake pad you want
Any fluids you want (brake, oil, coolant, transmission, differential)
Stock sized wheels within 6mm offset. This means 15"-18" diameter, 6.5"-7.0" wide, and an offset between +29 and +41. Spacers to count for offset reduction. Example, with a +35 offset wheel (such as stock), you can throw on a 5mm spacer and have an effective offset of +30 and be legal but you cannot use a +31 wheel and use a 3mm spacer. That would equal +28 which is too low of an offset.
Tires. This is the biggie. You can use a 140 treadwear or higher tire in this class in 2014. 200 treadwear or higher in 2015.
No, my car is totally stock minus tires and the Schrothe 3pt harness.
That reminds me!!
I just read this
http://blog.caranddriver.com/performance-brake-pads-compared-hawk-hps-hawk-hp-plus-ebc-yellowstuff/
car and driver compare a few different brake pads.
Autocrossing is an enduring topic and the info contributed here is appreciated. So for the first time in my experience, I've made a thread 'sticky'.
Autocrossing is an enduring topic and the info contributed here is appreciated. So for the first time in my experience, I've made a thread 'sticky'.
Awesome! I feel honored!!
Alright, I am doing much research on tires. I will post much info here in a bit.
Tires,
Easily the most important upgrade you can do to your vehicle. For 2015 street classes you are limited to a minimum tread wear of 200. I have heard a lot of people running things like the stock Pirelli P-zero’s, Star specs, Ventus RSIII’s (v2), Rivals, etc etc. But what do you choose?
Here is some info/tools/reviews I have found to help me.
Grassroots motorsports did a tire comparison test with a lightweight FWD autocross car, given, the test is 5 years old at this point, but still an interesting read.
http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/top-tires/
http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/texas-toasted-tires-part-2/
Secondly, Tire rack just did a series of tests with autocross capable rubber. This has some interesting data as well. Let it be said though that the testing was done with a RWD heavier vehicle, so testing should be taken with a grain of salt. Be sure to search through the tabs to see all the graphs and charts. I like charts. http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testDisplay.jsp?ttid=197
Probably the best tool I have found is to see what the best of the best used. The SCCA nationals results are posted every year after the event. Find a similar car in either GS class or HS class and see what tire they ran. http://scca.cdn.racersites.com/prod/assets/results/2014%20Tire%20Rack%20Solo%20Nationals%20Final1.pdf
Ultimately if you are choosing a tire that has been used by a champion or has enough notoriety to be tested vs other tires, odds are it will be an excellent choice. Good luck!
Easily the most important upgrade you can do to your vehicle. For 2015 street classes you are limited to a minimum tread wear of 200. I have heard a lot of people running things like the stock Pirelli P-zero’s, Star specs, Ventus RSIII’s (v2), Rivals, etc etc. But what do you choose?
Here is some info/tools/reviews I have found to help me.
Grassroots motorsports did a tire comparison test with a lightweight FWD autocross car, given, the test is 5 years old at this point, but still an interesting read.
http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/top-tires/
http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/articles/texas-toasted-tires-part-2/
Secondly, Tire rack just did a series of tests with autocross capable rubber. This has some interesting data as well. Let it be said though that the testing was done with a RWD heavier vehicle, so testing should be taken with a grain of salt. Be sure to search through the tabs to see all the graphs and charts. I like charts. http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testDisplay.jsp?ttid=197
Probably the best tool I have found is to see what the best of the best used. The SCCA nationals results are posted every year after the event. Find a similar car in either GS class or HS class and see what tire they ran. http://scca.cdn.racersites.com/prod/assets/results/2014%20Tire%20Rack%20Solo%20Nationals%20Final1.pdf
Ultimately if you are choosing a tire that has been used by a champion or has enough notoriety to be tested vs other tires, odds are it will be an excellent choice. Good luck!
i never have gotten to participate in an autocross event. i came pretty close once. it took me two hours to convince my wife to let me take the challenger we had around the course at the camaro5 event that came to town.... but by that time, they were shutting down.
however. when i went to daytona to do the driving experience, i won the autocross in our group. let me tell you that 3 runs was NOT enough. more more more more.
however. when i went to daytona to do the driving experience, i won the autocross in our group. let me tell you that 3 runs was NOT enough. more more more more.
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