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I'm glad you can see an example or two. There are lots of people who will not have anyone they can swap cars with. The entire point for many folks is that their sole car serves all of their needs. So while you have the opportunity to swap in these limited situations, and I have multiple vehicles, there will be a lot of folks who will be completely unwilling to compromise on much of anything in terms of the usage of their car.

ga2500ev
What’s the I3 battery degradation?
 

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Discussion Starter #42
Agreed, & in fact if something barely met the needs of the average person, it therefore would NOT meet the needs of around HALF the population. Still it WOULD meet the needs of many. 🖖;)

As for 500e REx, unless you could make it directly power the motor, it would still only add 6.6kW. That means with it running you'd only be able to drive about 200 miles at 50mph before your speed would be limited even further to about 45mph. :(
 

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Agreed, & in fact if something barely met the needs of the average person, it therefore would NOT meet the needs of around HALF the population. Still it WOULD meet the needs of many. 🖖;)

As for 500e REx, unless you could make it directly power the motor, it would still only add 6.6kW. That means with it running you'd only be able to drive about 200 miles at 50mph before your speed would be limited even further to about 45mph. :(
REx isn't the long term solution. It operates OK in the short term. The long term solution is a bit more range (minimum 150), fast charging, and enough charging stations between any two points someone might be interested in going.

As for a REx for the 500e, bypass the onboard charger and feed power directly into the HV battery system. Then there's less limits on the amount of power than could be delivered.

ga2500ev
 

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The average driver drives 29 miles per day: National Household Travel Survey Daily Travel Quick Facts | Bureau of Transportation Statistics

Even in the middle of the winter the 500e is capable of that. Obviously there are going to be different cases because there are many different situations, but I think there are far more drivers put off by the size and design of the 500e than the range based on actual need.

Only 3.3 million americans, or around 1% do the "stretch commute" described above: National Household Travel Survey "Stretch Commute" Quick Facts | Bureau of Transportation Statistics
 

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We as EV people really need to get off of this "average" kick. Would anyone buy a stove that works 90% of the time, but doesn't work at Thanksgiving? Or an HVAC system that works fine in the Spring, but fails to operate when it's 98 degrees out?

Regular people expect their cars to operate properly in virtually every situation. Many EV folks have fallen into the fallacy of thinking that since longer trips are not routine or average, that they are not common. While longer trips are not done often, virtually everyone takes them from time to time. I send fire to both sides of that argument. To folks who believe that sub-100 mile EVs with no fast charging is sufficient, see my arguments above. For those who believe that EVs will work only when they get 500 miles of range and can fully recharge in 5 minutes, it's pure overkill.

My bar is a 500 mile trip in a day. I've taken a couple of hundred such trips in my life. It's not unreasonable to expect a car to be able to take such a trip. We need enough range, and enough charging infrastructure to support an EV making such a trip. It's OK if an hour, or even two, charging has to be done to make the trip. With 200+ mile EVs, and growing fast charging networks, such trips are a reality in much of the US now. Once those vehicles get into the used market at reasonable prices, like 500e, LEAF, SoulEV, i3, and others are now, then we'll start to see an expansion of the EV market.

ga2500ev
 

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Even in the middle of the winter the 500e is capable of that. Obviously there are going to be different cases because there are many different situations, but I think there are far more drivers put off by the size and design of the 500e than the range based on actual need.
People are put off by the lack of range and slow charging speed. Put a used Chevy Bolt at exactly the same price point, and no one would keep them in stock even though the two are approximately the same size.

ga2500ev
 

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Would you guys buy the I 3, volt or e Golf?
It really feels like we are just talking past one another. See post #16 of this thread, which you never addressed. First off you are on a forum for FIAT 500e. So it's pretty clear what folks here would buy.

Also I keep asking what you need. Sometimes you give specs "40 amps and WiFi for an EVSE". But I do not believe I've ever read anything that you've written that indicates what you need out of an electrified car.

The only reason to discuss the i3, Volt, or E-golf along with the 500e is because of price. 3 year electrified cars along those lines are $20k and under in most places. So I'm going to presume that somewhere in there is your price point.

Tell us why the 500e doesn't meet your needs and maybe someone can give a better suggestion.

Given no information the best answer to any "what EV to buy?" question is likely a Tesla Model 3 or Model Y. Give some more information and maybe we can figure out why those are not the best choice.

ga2500ev
 

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I would beg to differ. Right now you can get a new 2020 bolt for $25K after factory discount. I'm not counting tax rebate because it's phased out for Chevy and local municipality rebates vary. Please show me a Tesla model 3, new or used, for the same price.


Yes but bolt it’s very expensive you could get a Tesla model3 with the same money
 

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Yeah, I don't think there is anyway to get a new Model 3 for anywhere near what you can get new Bolt for.
I thought there was still some tax rebate for the Chevy? Is it completely phased out already?

If you are looking for a relatively low cost pure EV with decent range and fast charging, I think the Bolt is the only option available.

If your daily drive is 30 to 40+ miles and you want to do that all electric, but you also want to be able to drive long distances without thinking about it, either generation Volt is a great option. New, you can get one for similar money as a Bolt. Used you can get one pretty cheap - close to 500e prices.

Personally, I'm over dealing with ICE. If I needed a car with longer range and was limited to under $30K, I would get a Bolt.
 

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Discussion Starter #60
$7,500 off your federal taxes no longer applies to Tesla or Chevy, but still valid on eKona.

Right now in Southern California Edison territory an eKona is $27,380 net, IF you're currently paying at least $7500 in federal tax (in order to be able to get your taxes actually reduced by that amount).

That's base model + $1120 freight, minus fed tax credit, CA rebate & $1k from SCE (which also applies to used purchase!)
 
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