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If ignorance was painful, I'd buy stock in Tylenol.

You can't blame a car company for trying to "play the game" by the rules that the federal government sets, but can the public at least try and engage a brain cell every now and again? I get tons of compliments on my car, but I also get a lot of people that ask what kind of millage I get, and then ask me why its so low. For the record, I drive a 500c automatic, and most of my driving is rush hour commute in moderate stop and go with enough traffic that I have several spots every day that take me multiple light cycles. I average 35 MPG, and yet, almost to a person, everyone immediately thinks that 35 MPG is terrible, especially for such a small car. AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

The problem is pretty simple, automakers are required to test their cars MPG in very specific ways and the prominently display the results on the window sticker. The represent the real world about as well as Kung Fu Panda represents martial arts. A few years ago, the government made a few changes to the way the test were done to try and make them more relevant (AC is on, they actually accelerate more aggressively etc.) While the changes did help a little, the issue remains that the test produces a number so vital to the automakers, that they design many of their cars to get the best possible EPA numbers...not the best actual millage. Since the highest number is the highway MPG, this one seems to be the one targeted most. Currently the magic number seems to be 40 MPG highway, with multiple cars making claims to that mark. Problem is they don't really get 40 MPG highway, and most get far worse in the city (claims of mid to upper 20's is common, while actual real world city MPG typically is low to mid 20's.) Hyundai is under attack by several consumer groups who say its 40 MPG claims are so far off real world results that they are threatening lawsuits....but I digress.

You see, the public has it in their minds that if you say you get less that 40 MPG, something must be wrong with you for buying the Fiat. They have been so conditioned by the years of highway MPG claims, that independent thought has apparently left the building.

There are some cars that get some REAL WORLD outstanding MPG, and the Fiat is by no means an MPG champion. It is however the first car I've ever owned that get much better MPG than its sticker, and it is very consistent with its fuel consumption city vs highway. Sure theres a difference, but its not 50% and anyone who thinks 35 MPG combined is bad is just wrong.

wow...forgot how much I like to rant ;)
 

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yeah I completley agree with you. Advertisers and car salesmen like to blow up numbers to get sales results, not really caring that a week after the customer owns it, they realize the 50 MPG they were told their mazda 2 would get, really only gets 35.

My fiat salesguy told me the 500 got "55 MPG in the city"..I had done my research and knew that wasnt accurate in the least. I really do think 35 MPG ( which is around what I get) is VERY good for in the city for a gas car. I sell VW's and when people ask me what a GTI gets for mileage I ALWAYS am upfront and say that even though the door sticker says 9.9 L/100 KM ( 29 mpg) I tell them the real world is actually around 27. Honesty usually gets me a sale, and if it doesnt, thats ok. I know that whatever car they end up with, they will be in for a shock when they realize they were lied to about fuel ecomony.
 

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The MPG game doesn't really matter to me, gas is cheap here in NJ and as long as I get 25 MPG or more...I am happy.
 

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Funny thing is there is a class action suit in LA against Honda for $10,000.00 for the coverage of the difference in the advertised and claimed MPG versus what this person was getting with her Civic Hybrid. The funny thing about it is that in small claims Honda is forbidden to have lawyers so it is a couple of engineers representing them. The claim filer is a former lawyer.. The judge is being very careful in his ruling on this one as he knows it can have more serious implications nationwide about the way carmakers advertise fuel mileage.

I don't blame the car companies as once one uses the highest numbers possible then all others have to follow suit or everyone asks the question of why does yours get so much less. It is hard for a salesperson to say "because they are lying".

It is sort of in a catch 22 situation until someone sets down ground rules for what is true and what is false advertising.. when in essence none of it is false just misleading..

Brion
 

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Funny thing is there is a class action suit in LA against Honda for $10,000.00 for the coverage of the difference in the advertised and claimed MPG versus what this person was getting with her Civic Hybrid. The funny thing about it is that in small claims Honda is forbidden to have lawyers so it is a couple of engineers representing them. The claim filer is a former lawyer.. The judge is being very careful in his ruling on this one as he knows it can have more serious implications nationwide about the way carmakers advertise fuel mileage.

I don't blame the car companies as once one uses the highest numbers possible then all others have to follow suit or everyone asks the question of why does yours get so much less. It is hard for a salesperson to say "because they are lying".

It is sort of in a catch 22 situation until someone sets down ground rules for what is true and what is false advertising.. when in essence none of it is false just misleading..

Brion
She took Honda to small claims court because she didn't want to be part of the class action suit. She is suing for 10K because that's the limit. If she joined the class action suit, the most she would get is $500
 

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35 mpg is good, but I'm getting 40 in city driving with stoplights. On my previous commute Is was getting consistently 42.7 in rush hour driving without stoplights. Actually they just changed the EPA mileage estimate rules to make all cars get lower mileage. I could beat the sticker on any car, I would wager. I have this amazing secret knowledge I will share with the forum: don't accelerate or decelerate quickly!
 

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35 mpg is good, but I'm getting 40 in city driving with stoplights. On my previous commute Is was getting consistently 42.7 in rush hour driving without stoplights. Actually they just changed the EPA mileage estimate rules to make all cars get lower mileage. I could beat the sticker on any car, I would wager. I have this amazing secret knowledge I will share with the forum: don't accelerate or decelerate quickly!
yeah. since they changed the rating method in 2008, i have yet to have a car where i didnt beat the epa numbers. it was pretty easy in my 500, and it has been pretty easy in my current car (veloster). i did it every tankful on the '08 corolla i had.

i will say these have all been mt's and anecdotally it sure seems like members in forums for those cars had more succes with the mt's as far as the epa number go.

true, you cant drive in any fashion that suits you. but with a little thinking and not doing anything extreme it is very achievable.

it has actually seemed to me that the 500 forums are plagued with far fewer complaints about being unable to hit epa numbers than any other forums.
 

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so I understand....

you are trying to tell me that achieving 30 mpg in a 4500 lb v-8 car is not realistic? but I believe EVERYTHING I see on TV!

In all seriousness, I get a combined average of 34mpg in my Fiat (12 in my Charger) and I am very happy with that.
Given my driving style and commute, I would have expected less.

And, for comparison - I got about 27mpg on my 2008 Yamaha 1100 Custom and I can drive the Fiat in the rain/ snow and on cold mornings (to be fair, I COULD have ridden the bike on these days, there was just no way I was going to), and the Fiat is about $50/ month cheaper!


oh, and finally...
"Maximiling" is the devils work... just sayin....
 

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A co-worker recently bought a new Elantra, the 40mpg one. He was astonished that his car could get better mileage than the tiny 500. Well, a few months in he is asking me about mileage and I say I'm averaging the hwy number and his superior mpg Elantra is avg mid to hi 20's. People need to research real world numbers that owners are actually getting to see the true story. 25mpg in a hemi Charger??? The guy who can get that is my hero, or lives at the top of a big hill.
 

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I am getting about 33.4 mpg on my Sport 5 speed manual. My car only has 1100 miles on her so I am hoping to do better after the car breaks in. I am told that mileage improves after around 4000 miles. I 've not push the car much and do mixes hwy and city driving.
 

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WHen anyone has asked me what mileage I get on the 500 my response is always in the format of "I get from 480-520Kms per tank, the tank is 40 liters." I never get asked what MPG is that or KM/L, most often they just ask whether that is City, Highway or mixed. My RX-8 would average about 320Kms per tank of gas and it had a 60 liter tank.
 

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I am getting about 33.4 mpg on my Sport 5 speed manual. My car only has 1100 miles on her so I am hoping to do better after the car breaks in. I am told that mileage improves after around 4000 miles. I 've not push the car much and do mixes hwy and city driving.
I drive ALOT of highway for work. I'm almost to 4K and can tell you that my mileage has gone up roughly 3 mpg in the past few weeks.. There is definately something to be said for these engines loosening up. That said I'm excited to see what kind of mileage I get when we get off of this terrible oxegynated winter fuel!!!
 

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Funny thing is there is a class action suit in LA against Honda for $10,000.00 for the coverage of the difference in the advertised and claimed MPG versus what this person was getting with her Civic Hybrid. The funny thing about it is that in small claims Honda is forbidden to have lawyers so it is a couple of engineers representing them. The claim filer is a former lawyer.. The judge is being very careful in his ruling on this one as he knows it can have more serious implications nationwide about the way carmakers advertise fuel mileage.

I don't blame the car companies as once one uses the highest numbers possible then all others have to follow suit or everyone asks the question of why does yours get so much less. It is hard for a salesperson to say "because they are lying".

It is sort of in a catch 22 situation until someone sets down ground rules for what is true and what is false advertising.. when in essence none of it is false just misleading..

Brion

UPDATE - She won the case against Honda and approx $10,000 ...

Brion
 

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I wasn't paying complete attention but when visiting with someone recently they had the TV going and it seems I heard a statement along the lines of by 2015 all car makers will be required to have all their or most of their vehicles getting at least 54.5 MPGs, I know it was right at 55 and I know it was stated require for all auto makers but I don't really recall the exact year or the all or most of portion,quick Google search returns mention of the 54.5 proposed fuel standard. Feel free to check it out yourself if you wish to know more. http://lmgtfy.com/?q=all+auto+to+get+54.5+mile+per+gallon
 

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I wasn't paying complete attention but when visiting with someone recently they had the TV going and it seems I heard a statement along the lines of by 2015 all car makers will be required to have all their or most of their vehicles getting at least 54.5 MPGs, I know it was right at 55 and I know it was stated require for all auto makers but I don't really recall the exact year or the all or most of portion,quick Google search returns mention of the 54.5 proposed fuel standard. Feel free to check it out yourself if you wish to know more. http://lmgtfy.com/?q=all+auto+to+get+54.5+mile+per+gallon


i believe the standards for those numbers are more forgiving than what is used for window sticker epa results
 

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The 55MPG average is for the CAFE standards which means that not all cars have to meet that but the average of the sold cars by the particular corporation is supposed to meet that.. which means that they are effectively forcing the car makers to make Smaller, Hybrid, Electric cars or you will get what you have seen in the past as being the Gas Guzzler Tax. 2016 it is supposed to be at 35.5MPG while a verbal agreement has been reached on a 54.5MPG Ave for 2025. Currently CAFE is at something like 25MPG.

So basically a car company has to sell 1 zero emission vehicle for every 4 20MPG average cars to currently meet a 25MPG CAFE
 

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The 55MPG average is for the CAFE standards which means that not all cars have to meet that but the average of the sold cars by the particular corporation is supposed to meet that.. which means that they are effectively forcing the car makers to make Smaller, Hybrid, Electric cars or you will get what you have seen in the past as being the Gas Guzzler Tax. 2016 it is supposed to be at 35.5MPG while a verbal agreement has been reached on a 54.5MPG Ave for 2025. Currently CAFE is at something like 25MPG.

So basically a car company has to sell 1 zero emission vehicle for every 4 20MPG average cars to currently meet a 25MPG CAFE
Correction Gas Guzzler Tax is something different but spawns from MPG Mandates.. The CAFE ave does fine manufacturers that do not meet it on a per car sold basis which could trickle down into the price of the cars.

Brion
 
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