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Discussion Starter #1
I'm thinking about buying a used 500e ('13 or '14). I currently have a Chevy Volt which has been incredibly reliable, but it's a second car now so stepping down in cost and up in electric range is tempting. My only concern boils down to two points: 1) Reliability, and 2) Battery degradation. Both I consider to be strong points of the Volt (and EV cars in general, minus degradation on the Leaf). It seems that the reliability issues stem from typical poor FCA quality control. Some 500e's are fine, some have issues. In that sense, a higher mileage example is tempting since that's a sort of indicator that it was at least reliable enough to get some good use. But that increases chances of battery degradation as well.

Would you have any misgivings about buying a used '13 or '14 with 25-35k miles (looking around $6000-$6500)? For those with higher mileage cars (35k+), what kind of range are you still able to get?
 

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I would have zero issue with buying a used 500e with ~35k miles. I know it's only one instance but my 500e has had zero problems or issues. The only thing I have ever done is replace the tires. Other than that it is just plug it in and drive.

As for battery degradation, one thing that the 500e has going for it is it has a controlled battery. Meaning that it has cooling/heating to keep the battery at an optimal temperature unlike the first gen Leaf battery where it is strictly air cooled. A down side is that the 500e doesn't have an on board degradation monitor like the Leaf does so it's tough to tell right off the condition of the battery. That being said I have never heard here or on several other sites of anyone loosing notable capacity. I'm at 24k miles and still have the same range as I did when new. Again, only a one car review but most seem to be pretty similar.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I would have zero issue with buying a used 500e with ~35k miles. I know it's only one instance but my 500e has had zero problems or issues. The only thing I have ever done is replace the tires. Other than that it is just plug it in and drive.

As for battery degradation, one thing that the 500e has going for it is it has a controlled battery. Meaning that it has cooling/heating to keep the battery at an optimal temperature unlike the first gen Leaf battery where
it is strictly air cooled. A down side is that the 500e doesn't have an on board degradation monitor like the Leaf does so it's tough to tell right off the condition of the battery. That being said I have never heard here or on several other sites of anyone loosing notable capacity. I'm at 24k miles and still have the same range as I did when new. Again, only a one car review but most seem to be pretty similar.
Thanks! Yes, the active thermal management (volt has it as well) makes me like the 500e over the Leaf .. Plus it's smaller and looks WAY cooler :) Glad yours is working out.

I'm actually in Hillsboro OR right near you. I know it sounds like you haven't had any issues - but any experience with Tonkin Fiat? I've read that some dealers don't service the 500e (they sell them, so I'd assume they'll service as well).
 

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Tonkin is now the only Fiat dealer in the Portland area. They just bought the dealership I got mine from (McLoughlin Auto) in Milwaukie and it does service the 500e. I've never been back though I need to as I have a service bulletin that I need to get fixed (software I think).
 

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I bought my 500e, and have taken it in for software updates, from Tonkin on Canyon. No complaints except they don't really have a waiting room, just two(?) tables in a corner of the showroom. They share the building with Alfa and there is signage to visit the coffee bar in the Alfa showroom so you at least get a good cup of coffee! The two times I've been in for updates, things went well and was done before their estimate.

mine is a low mileage (12K) 2015. I'm retired and the 500e has been my only car from the past year. Just putter around Beaverton, Hillsboro, Tigard: perfect!

craig
 

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Keep in mind the cell phone app ONLY works for the first three years. Might not be a problem/concern if you never had the app. In the first place. Also, the Tom-Tom GPS unit on 2015 and older 500e plug into the top of the dash and blocks my vision when attached. I think I've had the GPS attached twice in 2½ years. Again, not a problem if you don't use the ($$$ updates) GPS.

All in all, a fun car and I might lease another one next March.

Craig
 

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You can also mod the GPS cradle to be a phone mount/charger if you never use it. I never use the dash mount GPS either. My phone does a much better job especially when there's traffic.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Yeah, I didn't bother paying for service after the Onstar app expired. And I don't really care about the GPS mount, I'll probably just use my phone
 

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I agree, battery degradation seems to be a non-issue with the 500e thus far.
Rest comfortably knowing that Bosch, not FCA, developed the EV drivetrain on the car :D
 

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My plan is to buy a Tesla 3; I put down my deposit the weekend they let us. Did some math the other day... I can lease a new Fiat 500e every three years for the next 20 years for the same money. I like the Fiat enough that I'm seriously considering that instead.


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FCA needs to keep average MPG down. I don't see them killing the 500e without replacing it with something else. We'll see.


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That's really the question of the day.

They have no true ZEV's in the pipeline according to industry analysts, and they can't meet compliance requirements without them.


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FCA needs to keep average MPG down. I don't see them killing the 500e without replacing it with something else. We'll see.


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There have been a few claims the 500e is done. I spoke with someone who is a supplier for 500e components and he said production of the parts they make have already stopped. He said he didn't know for sure but speculated there would no 2018 500e. So either FCA has an all electric of something else coming or they are putting all their eggs in the pacifica hybrid or they have something else coming that no one knows about.
 

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If the 500e is dead, one of the following must happen:
- A true ZEV to replace it, so either all-electric or hydrogen fuel cell that sells in sufficient quantities
- A merger

They can't meet emission requirements with Hybrids alone anymore. It has to be full ZEV and not PZEV


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If the 500e is dead, one of the following must happen:
- A true ZEV to replace it, so either all-electric or hydrogen fuel cell that sells in sufficient quantities
- A merger

They can't meet emission requirements with Hybrids alone anymore. It has to be full ZEV and not PZEV
What is the penalty if they don't sell a ZEV, or not in sufficient quantity? Do you have a reference to the actual regulations?
 

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What is the penalty if they don't sell a ZEV, or not in sufficient quantity? Do you have a reference to the actual regulations?

The penalty for not meeting the mandate is stiff:
They will not be able to sell ANY cars in CA.

That's why they discount the 500e so steeply, they simply have no choice and must move a specific number of them.

Here ya go:
https://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/zevprog/zevregs/1962.2_Clean.pdf


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If the 500e is dead, one of the following must happen:
- A true ZEV to replace it, so either all-electric or hydrogen fuel cell that sells in sufficient quantities
- A merger

They can't meet emission requirements with Hybrids alone anymore. It has to be full ZEV and not PZEV
That's a very dense document, and I'll admit that I'm not able to follow it. I searched for something that condenses it to something more readable, and came across this:
https://www.c2es.org/us-states-regions/policy-maps/zev-program
As I understand it, starting from 2018 PZEV will no longer qualify for credits, but TZEV (including plug-in hybrids and specifically the Chrysler Pacifica Hybrid) continue to qualify for credits. Each Pacifica Hybrid will only yield a fraction of the credit for one 500e, but I think FCA will sell more than enough of them to offset the loss of the very low production 500e.
 
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