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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I had someone ask me about my Fiat and mention he was thinking about the new Scion IQ too. I asked him if he had ever seen one, he said only on the web, and it became apparent he didnt realize the size of the car. I knew the numbers for it, but decided to run a quick photoshop...wow. I think Fiat has found that magic sweet spot (so has mini) for size. You get any smaller and it just doesnt feel like a real car anymore. I drive my Fiat on the interstate without hesitation. Im not bashing the IQ, havnt driven one yet, and it may be an great little town car. Im just wondering if Toyota has miscalculated with the xtra small size.
 

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Wow, I gotta strongly disagree with you Mike. Keep in mind that most people complain that the Fiat and Mini aren't real cars and we ignore them or insult their intelligence on the basis of ignorance. No difference just because the Scion is smaller still. Keep in mind these cars were designed as European city cars. I haven't driven one, but I'd expect it to feel as 'real' as the fiat. My knock against it is that it doesn't seem as fun of the fiat, the fuel economy numbers are better but not mind blowing, and the interior seems much cheaper than expected. Now as far as the Smart is concerned, it's just a pure piece of carp. Poor engine, terrible transmission, and poor fuel economy for all of the sacrifices. And yes, I have driven the Smart. They were practically giving them away at one point 1-2 years ago. I can't believe that Merecedes willingly takes credit for that pos.
 

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....I drive my Fiat on the interstate without hesitation.
as a prevous smart owner, I also drove mine on the interstate, without hesitation, 5 days a week, for nearly 2 years. we even took a couple trips from Indy to KC and enjoyed the trips. no problems other than the occasional idiot driver that would pull up next to me and gawk...for a mile or so, then drive off. also had the occasional DA that would pass and then immediately cut in front of me. not sure what kind of message that was suppose to send me other than 'look at me, I drive like the idiot I am'. :p

I'm sure the I.Q. will do better than the smart, but there are still a lot of Americans that don't care for micro cars, which is what the smart and I.Q are catagorized as.

in my mind (scary place....I KNOW) the Mini and 500 are in the same class, which does NOT include the smart and I.Q.
 

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It is designed to compete with the Smart, they are a different class of car than the 500 (which is a different class than the Mini).

I disagree. the Mini and 500 are very similar in many ways, especially size. the 500 is only about 7" shorter than the Mini.

there can't be a 'class' for each and every car just because they aren't exactly the same size, otherwise there would be THOUSANDS of 'classes' with only 2 or 3 in each class. :rolleyes:
 

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If the mini and 500 aren't in the same class, don't tell people cross shopping. I've seen a dozen minis for sale used at my Fiat studio's lot in the last 5 months. So much so people have asked me about the new Mini/Fiat dealer in town.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
as a prevous smart owner, I also drove mine on the interstate, without hesitation, 5 days a week, for nearly 2 years.....
How was the noise level at 60-70 in the Smart? Thats one of the other concerns I have with the IQ is that its CVT will drone on endlessly. I was amazed at how quiet even the 500c was at speed...which really made the purchase easier for me.

I hope the IQ succeeds, I was just shocked at how much closer it was to the Smart in size. Im not some eco-nut, I just think that if there are more options for smaller cars the streets will be less crowded for my commute :D
 

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How was the noise level at 60-70 in the Smart? Thats one of the other concerns I have with the IQ is that its CVT will drone on endlessly. I was amazed at how quiet even the 500c was at speed...which really made the purchase easier for me.

I hope the IQ succeeds, I was just shocked at how much closer it was to the Smart in size. Im not some eco-nut, I just think that if there are more options for smaller cars the streets will be less crowded for my commute :D

the noise level 'is what it is', as they say. the car is NOT very soundproof, so there is a lot of wind noise. the engine does make some noise as well, but since its behind you, its not as noticible at 60-70 mph as you might think.

being on a couple smart forums for 3 years or so, we've done a lot of discussing of the I.Q. in regards to how it compares to the smart. just my opinion, but I think the I.Q. will blow the smart away, not only in the usual stats but in dealer network. the 'smart centers' in the U.S. are dwindling and smart/MB doesn't seem to be too concerned about it.

as a past smart customer, my biggest complaint with smart was taking my $16,000 smart into the smart center/MB dealer and being treated like a 3rd world illegal alien. on top of that, should I have any non-warranty work done, I would be paying MB labor rates. ummm, excuse me, I paid $16,000 for this car and I'm NOT paying $120-150/hr for your MB techs to work on it. :(

the Toyota dealer network is far superior in not only numbers but to customers needs, so the I.Q. I believe will go far. I wouldn't buy one as I don't care for the looks of it, but I'm sure they'll get quite a few smart defectors, just as Fiat has. :D
 

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I disagree. the Mini and 500 are very similar in many ways, especially size. the 500 is only about 7" shorter than the Mini.

there can't be a 'class' for each and every car just because they aren't exactly the same size, otherwise there would be THOUSANDS of 'classes' with only 2 or 3 in each class. :rolleyes:
The Mini is a B-segment car, the same as an Accent, Fiesta, Fit, etc. The Fiat 500 is smaller than all of the mentioned cars, and in a class below that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
The Mini is a B-segment car, the same as an Accent, Fiesta, Fit, etc. The Fiat 500 is smaller than all of the mentioned cars, and in a class below that.

Except in that here in the USA (and I think Canada too) the Mini is a MiniCompact class car (as defined by interior passenger volume+cargo volume)...which puts it with the Fiat 500...in fact I think the Fiat has slightly more interior volume than the Mini.

Honestly though, no matter how you want to look at it, the cars are essentially in the same class, even if in some countries the mini squeaks into the next size up by and inch or a few pounds or whatever. People looking at the Fiat, are very often also looking at the Mini.
 

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If the mini and 500 aren't in the same class, don't tell people cross shopping. I've seen a dozen minis for sale used at my Fiat studio's lot in the last 5 months. So much so people have asked me about the new Mini/Fiat dealer in town.
I'm one of those former MINI owners who traded 3 months ago for the 500 (a much better car for sure). At 140" vs 147" in overall length the 500 and MINI sit squarely in the same class, but are they compact or subcompact? I consider them subcompacts. It used to be that compacts were considered to be any car less than about 162" in length, but the dividing line between subcompact and compact is a little fuzzy and is a moving target. To confuse matters even more, EPA says a subcompact car is one in which the total interior volume falls between 85 and 99 cu.ft. The MINI (82 cu.ft.) and the Fiat 500 (85 cu,ft.) are certainly comparable in that regard, but at 82 cu.ft. is the MINI something less than a subcompact by EPA's definition?

The VW golf weighs in at 161" in length, and with a much bigger back seat, probably should be labeled a compact. On the other hand, the iQ at 117" and Smart at 98" are microcars by any definition.
 

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The 500 and the smart have nothing in common. I own both cars. The smart is very crude compared to the Fiat. The 500 is a lot wider and longer in size. Ride quality is a lot better in the 500 too. You feel like your in a large car in the 500. I own a Honda Fit too. The 500 is in between both, the size of the Fit and the smart car. The smart gets more attention then the 500. It's very quiet on the highway. Has better gas milage too. The 500 feel more luxurious. The smart is a great little run about. I never have had issue in the 3 year of use. I do feel a lot safer in the 500. Its only a foot or 2 longer. Both are great cars, but NO comparison.

 

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If the mini and 500 aren't in the same class, don't tell people cross shopping. I've seen a dozen minis for sale used at my Fiat studio's lot in the last 5 months. So much so people have asked me about the new Mini/Fiat dealer in town.
I'll bet they bought them at auction to make it appear like folks are trading MINI's like mad to buy FIAT's.

And they'll make $1,000 or more on the used MINI compared to a few hundred on the FIAT each time they successfully move a slightly disappointed FIAT customer to a more substantial and lightly used MINI for about the same price.
 

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I'll bet they bought them at auction to make it appear like folks are trading MINI's like mad to buy FIAT's.

And they'll make $1,000 or more on the used MINI compared to a few hundred on the FIAT each time they successfully move a slightly disappointed FIAT customer to a more substantial and lightly used MINI for about the same price.
I don't know, there were two on the lot where I bought my 500, and I saw at least two more drive slowly by with necks that could not be craned more, gawking widely at a lot full of Fiats. For that matter a ton of gawkers driving by slowly and staring.
 
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