[MikeV2113]

Didn’t they announce a new fiat 500e in the making? I think it’s not sold here in the states but there were some reddit posts about it. I think they actually designed the body to accommodate an ev style battery instead of retrofitting it to an ICE chassis. Would like to know the specs on that

 

[Electric Tire Shredder]

Correct, on an EV-specific chassis in Italy, "in the making" so "not sold here" might be a bit premature. I have to admit though, for a "retrofit" ours are awfully nice! (as is the eGolf, eFocus, & eSoul) In fact, I'd rather have any of those than a Leaf, which is built on an EV-specific chassis!!

 

[MikeV2113]

Very true, I just saw under the hood of a Kona and the space the electric drive train took up was comically small. It was pretty much empty under the hood. The build quality was so so. I do like the styling of the fiat and that German drive train

 

[biohazard]

I seriously do plan to attempt this upgrade, but not until after my battery starts having range issues. (So probably not for several years) I'll buy some of the 90ah and some of the 120ah cells from the i3 and compare them when I do before I buy the actual battery pack. In the mean time, I found this listing for the 90ah cells. I believe they are the same ones as in the i3:

Li-Ion SDI94 Battery Cell 3.7V 94AH, Samsung NMC | shop.GWL.eu

Li-Ion SDI94 Battery Cell 3.7V 94AH, Samsung NMC - Introduction Technical information Complete datasheet Original name Samsung SDI 94Ah. Battery chemistry is NCM (nickel-manganese-cobalt). Recommended initial and subsequent charging is to 4,15 V. The minimum voltage is 2.7 V. Maximum discharge curre

shop.gwl.eu

 

[Rick C.]

I know this thread has been quiet for two months, but I felt the need to submit some information. The Samsung SDI 63 Ah cells as found in the 500e are the same physical size as the 94 Ah models found in the i3. Even doing the work my self (I have an engineering background), without taking the car off the road for a prolonged time period, I would have to procure both another 500e battery housing and an orphaned i3 housing. Right now, it's a money issue. When the project arrives at completion, I would of course have the battery modules from the other Fiat battery to resell, and a complete (the original from my 500e) battery housing to sell if I chose to do so, thus recouping some of the costs. With the COVID downturn in the economy, this is project I won't be undertaking in the near future.

 

[carrrl]

I’m curious if it would “just work.” For example is the car hardcoded to only expect a 24kwh pack? Would suck to invest all that time and money to find it’s just not possible without redoing a ton of the other systems. I’d consider the time/money investment if I knew it would work at a system level.

Having to fab/fix module casings would be a pain as the evolving world video seems to indicate.

 

[ga2500ev]

I’m curious if it would “just work.” For example is the car hardcoded to only expect a 24kwh pack? Would suck to invest all that time and money to find it’s just not possible without redoing a ton of the other systems. I’d consider the time/money investment if I knew it would work at a system level.

Having to fab/fix module casings would be a pain as the evolving world video seems to indicate.

The battery system is voltage driven. While the columb counter that estimates the remaining amp-hours may be off (or maybe can be recalibrated?) the 500e is fully charged when the main system voltage is just shy of 400V. So it'll charge to that voltage, and presumably will base the battery remaining based on the remaining voltage, which seems to be a pretty linear decline.

So I would guess that the car would go a lot farther, take longer to charge, and have gauges that are inaccurate.

ga2500ev

 

[Rick C.]

Correct. The batteries are behind all of the main electronics that matter. They don't care if they're being fed from a half charged battery, a fully charged battery, or for the sake of this discussion, an additional battery placed in parallel with the factory battery*. The voltage the system needs to see is unchanged. Were there may be a problem, and I won't know until I analyze how the circuit works, is that both the charge percentage display and the mileage 'guess-o-meter' display may give erroneous readings. If the factory system looks ONLY at current flow/elapsed charge time into the battery while charging, and then uses those figures to calculate battery capacity, then both numbers should respond accordingly. If not, there should be approximately a 50% error going from the smaller battery to the larger battery, that being a simple proportion of the capacity increase. But again, this is all academic until I can inspect the electronics in a battery, finances willing, as I grow more nervous looking at global finance reports.

*Consider your laptop as a similarly functioning device. If we cut into the battery and place another equivalent battery in parallel with the main battery, it'll work for approximately twice as long, and of course, with no change in the charging circuit, take twice as long to charge.)

 

[Electric Tire Shredder]

Note that charge time would be the same* for the same daily commute, since the charger would still add the same number of miles per hour. It would ONLY take "longer to charge" after driving longer than before, due to more available range.

*Okay, IF all else is equal it could take a bit longer since a heavier battery takes more power to carry around, but the aging stock battery that it's replacing would likely have built up higher internal resistance, which probably slows the charge rate.

 

[ga2500ev]

I should have clarified that charging longer is a 0-100% SOC situation. If 120 Ah cells are swapped in, then it would take just about twice as long from 0-100% SOC. Of course double the range would be awesome.

This would have to be coupled with a DCFC retrofit. At that point the 500e would be a quite effective all around vehicle.

ga2500ev

 

[Electric Tire Shredder]

Agreed, but I wouldn't say "have to" have DCFC, since with double the range it would still fully recharge from zero during 8 hours of sleep OR work on L2

 

[ga2500ev]

Agreed, but I wouldn't say "have to" have DCFC, since with double the range it would still fully recharge from zero during 8 hours of sleep OR work on L2

Note I stated an "effective all around vehicle". We've discussed in the past the notion that all an EV needs to accomplish is to be a commuter and charge overnight. While that's a typical usage, it's not the only one. Now I know that we've all decided to accept the limitations with our 500e. But it is a bit disingenuous to dismiss those limitations.

For example one simple trip for me is Atlanta to Savannah GA. It's about 250 miles. It's completely impossible to do in a single day with a current FIAT 500e. Even with double the range you can only get about halfway there. But there are enough DCFC charging stations along the way that the trip could be made with a couple of extra hours of charging.

Without DCFC one is forced to limit one's trips to within the range of the car because folks are not going to spend 4-8 hours waiting to charge. DCFC frees EVs from their range bonds because they can recharge fast enough to get to places they could not reach before in reasonable timeframes.

Faster charging is in fact more important that more range. While more range gives long hops, faster charging facilitates taking more than one hop outside the range of the vehicle in the same day.

I admit I traded this limitation for the cost of my 500e. But it really doesn't make sense to be dismissive of faster charging for EVs.

ga2500ev

 

[Electric Tire Shredder]

Right. I was thinking about all the people like my friend with a plug at work but only street parking at home, where the stock 500e doesn't really work very well on weekends even for local trips, but with double range they might be able to go all weekend without needing to stop just to charge.

 

[Watt_Up]

I'm about to attempt my longest trip on a single charge. 90miles. Left the house at 99% SOC. I have already gone 58 miles. Sitting at 42% SOC. Guess O meter says 45 miles with AC off. A little more battery sure would help to alleviate the range anxiety I'm about to experience.

 

[Kiesling]

I'm about to attempt my longest trip on a single charge. 90miles. Left the house at 99% SOC. I have already gone 58 miles. Sitting at 42% SOC. Guess O meter says 45 miles with AC off. A little more battery sure would help to alleviate the range anxiety I'm about to experience.

Go down hill!
But seriously, you should be fine assuming no crazy elevation changes. You're on track for 100 miles, so you should have some reserve when you arrive at your destination.

 

[Watt_Up]

Go down hill!
But seriously, you should be fine assuming no crazy elevation changes. You're on track for 100 miles, so you should have some reserve when you arrive at your destination.
[/QUOTE

Unfortunately all up hill. A gradual climb of only 250ft elevation though. I took the side roads half way driving very conservatively, 35-45mph. Last half no choice, 55mph. Made it home with 14% SOC.

They say speed kills and that is definitely true when it comes to battery life. Altering your route may take a little longer, but if possible it is a free way to extend battery range.

 

[ga2500ev]

I'm completely jealous. Just another example of knowing that I have a bad battery but not being able to prove it. I took a run this morning. 30 miles total on back roads at 40 MPH. It consumed half my battery. Efficiency at 3.6 mi/kWh.

Drive slower is definitely a strategy. But with mine I feel it's GIGO: Garbage In, Garbage Out.

The only number that seems to point to the degregation is the Total Amp Hours. Last I checked it was at 42. But like every other OBD2 number, we have no idea of its validity.

ga2500ev

 

[Watt_Up]

I'm completely jealous. Just another example of knowing that I have a bad battery but not being able to prove it. I took a run this morning. 30 miles total on back roads at 40 MPH. It consumed half my battery. Efficiency at 3.6 mi/kWh.

Drive slower is definitely a strategy. But with mine I feel it's GIGO: Garbage In, Garbage Out.

The only number that seems to point to the degregation is the Total Amp Hours. Last I checked it was at 42. But like every other OBD2 number, we have no idea of its validity.

ga2500ev

How many miles on your car?

Mine is a 2017 and I just hit 9000 miles. My normal route is 30 miles one way. 25 miles at 55mph and the last 5 miles are 35-45. Leaving the house at 100% SOC I can make it to work showing 65%. That is with no AC and ambient temps in the 70's.

On hotter days with AC running I'm around 60% SOC when I arrive.

I usually make it back home with SOC showing 22-30% depending on AC use.

 

[ga2500ev]

2014. 54,000 and change on the mileage. I finished my day today at 36 miles and down to 33%. Clearly a vast difference in battery effectiveness.

ga2500ev

 

[LanceN500e]

December 8, 2020 I bought a 2014 500e. Got it really cheap! Should even have some battery warranty left on it. Love it so far! (Her name is Pearl Jetson). But, def want more range eventually. I am a competent mechanic, in southern Oregon. If anyone wants to work together and make a battery pack, or bounce ideas off each other, etc, my car could be a willing guinea pig for an updated pack. In the next few years for sure, I’m going to try and accomplish getting this done. I’m not afraid to tackle the project if I can find an i3 pack, or etc. for a reasonable price.

I’ve been scared once with it down to 8%, but never saw the turtle haha! Weird tho, as temperature must really affect the battery. a normal highway speed 45 mile round trip drive usually will get me home with about 18% left. But it was 39 degrees out and I had heat on, on the way there, but got scared and had it off on the way home. And made it with 8%.

I love cars, ICE or otherwise, and can totally see how nice these electrics are going to be. This one feels a lot like I’m using a iPhone 1. I saw the potential but until the iPhone 4th gen was released, wasn’t really ‘there yet’. everything on this car is here, torque, comfort, drivability except for the range and charge speed.

Get this range figured out, and the slow charging situation and these electrics will replace most ICE vehicles I’m sure of it.